Fw: OTP, OECD and tax collection

[John Messing <jmessing@law-on-line.com>]

-----Original Message-----
From: John Messing <jmessing@law-on-line.com>
To: Steve Howard <showard@certicom.com>
Date: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 9:38 AM
Subject: Re: OTP, OECD and tax collection


>There is an excellent website which maintains current information on the
>state of digital signature laws on a jurisdiction by jurisdiction basis.
>Check out www.mbc.com. I am giving a course over the Internet in November
>for attorneys seeking professional legal education credit on the subject,
>and will be happy to provide updates via private email on the various
>subjects of interest to anyone who requests me to do so via private email
to
>me.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Steve Howard <showard@certicom.com>
>To: John Messing <jmessing@law-on-line.com>
>Date: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 10:20 AM
>Subject: Re: OTP, OECD and tax collection
>
>
>>Hi John,
>>
>>Do you have any insight/shareable info on digital signature law?  Have
>>there been any court cases upholding digital signatures?
>>
>>Steve
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>John Messing <jmessing@law-on-line.com> on 10/04/98 01:09:27 PM
>>
>>To:   ietf-trade@lists.eListX.com, Steve Schear <schear@lvcm.com>
>>cc:    (bcc: Steve Howard/Certicom)
>>Subject:  Re: OTP, OECD and tax collection
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>This is one of those issues which is not as straightforward as it may
first
>>appear. Apart from merchants whose businesses are physically located
within
>>the borders of an EEC state, the power of the state to tax may depend upon
>>notions of extraterritorial application of the tax laws. Thus, if an
>>American corporation sells goods to a German citizen and has no office or
>>outlet in Germany, then in a non-virtual transaction, there is little
legal
>>basis for Germany to claim the right to tax the transaction. The German
>>citizen had to have been physically located in another jurisdiction to
have
>>completed the purchase. But in a virtual transaction where the Internet
>>server and the seller are located physically outside of Germany, the
>>situation may be less clear. If Germany claims the right to tax any
>>transaction involving a buyer whose computer or delivery address is
located
>>within its borders, a question will arise about the basis in international
>>law of the power to tax. To the extent that consent to tax is one such
>>basis, then inclusion of software at the Internet server used by the
seller
>>which permits German taxation through OTP could arguably be implied
consent
>>to tax -- a result perhaps never intended by OTP or the buyer. It is quite
>>conceivable that Germany would hire an American attorney to collect such
>>taxes as postulated by this example through the American courts, which an
>>American corporation could not ignore. Apart from the issue of taxation,
>>there are other questions about extraterritorial applicable of laws, such
>>as
>>digital signature legislation, which involve similar considerations. In
>>order to avoid such questions, OTP refused to consider them in earlier
>>drafts. Taking a position or refusing to take a position on such issues in
>>light of the German request probably will result practically in a
>>substantive decision one way or the other, like it or not, which means
that
>>such questions can no longer continue to be ignored as either a
theoretical
>>or practical matter.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Steve Schear <schear@lvcm.com>
>>To: ietf-trade@lists.eListX.com <ietf-trade@lists.eListX.com>
>>Date: Saturday, October 03, 1998 10:23 PM
>>Subject: RE: OTP, OECD and tax collection
>>
>>
>>>David Burdett <David.Burdett@mondex.com> wrote:
>>>>Tax evasion is as old as the centuries. I doubt that OTP if its used for
>>>>tax collection by the governments will change peoples inclination to pay
>>>>(or not pay) one bit. The point is, if governments want to collect taxes
>>>>then they will find a way to do it and most merchants who have a
>>>>reputation to protect will follow it.
>>>
>>>This is really a rear-view outlook.  If we were in the 16th century, its
>>>like saying that because the Church has all this authority we're not
going
>>>to use the press to print anything secular.
>>>
>>>While it may be true that in the short run merchants with reputation may
>>go
>>>along with this foolishness, as long as their risks are low consumers
will
>>>shop wherever the price is lowest. 10% or more tax is enough separate
most
>>>consumers from their guilt and place the loyal merchants at a
considerable
>>>disadvantage. The complaint merchants will pressure the governments to
get
>>>tough (regulation always favors the regulated). If governments are not
>>able
>>>to pressure the non-complaint merchants, as I believe they will not (as
>>>they were unable to stem the Eurodollar trading), this is the beginning
of
>>>the end game for such taxes on the Net and perhaps in a broader sense as
>>>more commerce moves to the Net and places local merchants at an
increasing
>>>disadvantage.
>>>
>>>--Steve
>>>
>>>
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>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>

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